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Welcome to the Sound Off Discussion Board, where parents from all walks of life and all parts of the world come together in one place to share their opinions and thoughts about the question of the week. Please remember that everyone is entitled to their opinion and the freedom to express it. Obscene posts are unwelcome and shall be removed from the board. Please keep in mind that this is a public board. Never post personal information that you would be uncomfortable sharing with others. Comments about this board should be sent to iParenting's Webmaster. Thank you for contributing! If you have a suggestion for the question of the week, send it to feedback@iparenting.com.

As the year comes to a close, did you fulfill your 2003 new year resolutions?

For archived topics, click here.

I realize LH can reply for herself, but Anna it is coming across as if you ARE trying to start something with her for whatever reason. All she did was voice her opinion of what is happening to this board and you jumped all over her and offered an analysis of her dissapointment. Those of us who have been posting here for awhile are trying to resolve things, and having someone who maybe was "lurking" (btw if you aren't aware that is not a put down, but the officail techy term for someone who reads a board but doesn't post) here but has never participated in a single conversation ever start whipping things up as well is just silly. You have the right to post here, and post whatever you want, so please don't think I am saying you shouldn't be here (not that you would care) only that we really don't need more of this. This kind of response is only proving LH's point.
I really am sorry for your dh's death. I have a good idea of how painful it must be for you and how lonely you must be because I know 2 families who have lost husbands/dads this last year and have seen how painful it is for them: one a mom of 4. I hope that you find a positive outlet for your grief and anger that you are undoubtedly experiencing. Just don't let some of us here be your punching bag, ok?
Now I have something VERY important to do: help my daughter dress her dolls that she just changed (he's a stinky boy mommy). LOL she's adorable.
Margarita
Friday, January 02, 2004 at 21:46:01 (EST)
oh my typing..geez sorry. That is bought and HCG. Uggh.
Cherokee
Friday, January 02, 2004 at 21:28:32 (EST)
Hey Kerri - glad to hear the evening was a **success**. If dh needed CPR it had to have gone well ;P

Wanted to ask you - your opinion of those internet sites that sell pg tests? I bout some that claim they pick up HCH at 20 mcU. They say that you can test positive as early 6 DPO. Whaddya think? That would be tomorrow for me!
Cherokee
Friday, January 02, 2004 at 21:27:16 (EST)
OOps...the site:


http://www.909shot.com/
Saraj
Friday, January 02, 2004 at 21:14:21 (EST)
As far as the vaccine issue...this is a pretty good site, too. There's also a book by Neil Z. Miller...It's called "Vaccines, Arew They Really Safe and Effective?" Your local library should carry it.

Now, before we go on, I think it should be agreed that no one belittles anyone in this debate. I absolutely DO NOT think I am "holier than thou". LOL! I am the exact opposite, actually. It's very hard to get an impression of who a person really is online.
Anyway, comments like the few below "since you are so uneducated yourself" is an example. I'd like to think most of you are mature enough to handle not cutting on someone with these kinds of words. All it does is make you look bad, anyway.

I haven't cut on anyone, even after all of the terrible things said about me. And, I never would cut on any of you.

So, once it's agreed~I'm in.
Saraj
Friday, January 02, 2004 at 21:13:02 (EST)
This will explain unschooling....it's a long winded subject! ;-)

http://www.naturalchild.com/guest/earl_stevens.html
Saraj
Friday, January 02, 2004 at 21:07:02 (EST)
Angela and Cherokee-NYE was wonderful! The dress was actually one I wore before so it was a good chance to get in a second "wearing". I think dh did need a little CPR after the event! :)

SARAJ-we are still waiting to hear what your "reasoning" is for the "UNSCHOOLING" (still don't fully understand how someone who is obviously uneducated herself can homeschool or educate anyone to begin with), and also the rationale for raising your children without morals or values...
Kerri
Friday, January 02, 2004 at 20:34:24 (EST)
LH- Drama? ohhhh, the other people on this board were right...it's okay for you but NOT everyone else. I see.


Anna L.
Friday, January 02, 2004 at 17:14:42 (EST)
AnnaL...listen, I don't really think your being fair here...you apparently have chosen ME to start abit of forum "drama" with and well...I'm sorry to say, I just don't go for that sort of thing and would really appreciate it if you would just DROP IT!

I am sorry about your husband...I truely am...I love my husband dearly and would die myself if something happened to him!

I enjoy driving my car fast yes...but I also am quite responsible about it! It makes me feel young again and carefree...so cut me a break here.. Other than that...I don't really feel the need to defend myself anymore...

Hey iparenting...new question plez!!!


LH
Friday, January 02, 2004 at 17:00:50 (EST)
Coming from someone who just lost the man I adored most of my adult life - lost to someone who was driving carelessly - I find your flippant ("only if I can get away with it") attitude perfectly representative of your behavior on this board. Hope YOU don't kill somebody in your fast little car. Careful, unless you are a trained NASCAR driver, I find it really irresponsible that you can brag about speeding when you could hurt someone else.
Anna L.
Friday, January 02, 2004 at 15:45:55 (EST)
Riley...I'm sure we've come full circle here now! TY and TC! :-)

Margarita...yes, I do speed...but only on occassion and when I'm sure I can get away with it! I have a 16 year old daughter that just started driving in June, so I have to be careful...she does like her cars though and often can "car-talk" the boys into a hole..LOL! I have a red Mustang 5.0 and she has one too...but hers is only a V6...still a nice car, but not as fast as mom&dads!!
LH
Friday, January 02, 2004 at 14:38:24 (EST)
Angela, regarding vaccinations, those are my thoughts exactly. I have been to Africa and the Middle East, and to see the problems not vaccinating causes is really scary stuff. People say: yes, but this isn't Iran, this isn't Africa. I say: Right, because we have medical resources available to us. That is what separates us. Do you know how large the population infected with Aids is in Africa just when I was there? (and that was 9 years ago), and it is much more adanced now. Dysentary, polio, pertusis is big down there too. Dysentary isn't something you can vaccinate against, but the others sure are. Mexico also does not require vaccinations, and several states are "open" borders to Mexico. Now, I am not a medical person. But, you don't have to be, once you have been in these situations to see - it just makes sense to vaccinate.
Anna L.
Friday, January 02, 2004 at 13:48:57 (EST)
AnnaL - sorry to hear about your husband.
Margarita
Friday, January 02, 2004 at 13:44:42 (EST)
Julie, you are right. I do feel like I "know" alot of you - it didn't even occur to me that people on this board might not know ME. Sorry :0) I have visited this site on many occasions. Some of the debates have been interesting, irritating and sometimes just plain stupid. I didn't mean to come off all mysterious.

I will give you some information about me, if that will put you at ease (since LH seems to think I am a ghost): I am 32, a widowed parent of two girls aged 3 (Sierra)and 4 (Josie). I am currently in limboland deciding what to do with the rest of my life with my husband gone (killed in a car accident 6 months ago)Just taking some time to smell the roses now with the kids. I spend alot of time on the internet (usually at night) to talk to people. I also don't sleep well. I hear you on the procrastination - it is a way to divert from the stuff I don't like to do. I do it a lot lately.

Anyway. I have tried to message board on sites for people who have lost their spouses in my age group, but they are either SO depressed that I'M ready to die, or trolling for dates which I'm totally not interested in. So that is about me. Oh. And before I took a sebatical, I worked as a head hunter (employment recruiter). But I don't know if I'll go back to that.


Anna L.
Friday, January 02, 2004 at 13:37:38 (EST)
Where's Philbert, I miss him. Hope he didn't stop posting here too.
Margarita
Friday, January 02, 2004 at 13:37:36 (EST)
Sorry ladies, I refreshed my page and it posted my message twice.
Margarita
Friday, January 02, 2004 at 13:34:35 (EST)
As far as vaccinations. Yep! All three of our little ones have been vaccinated. There is no proof that vaccines really hurt them, though when we lived in the UK they thought there might be some correlation between the MMR vaccine and autism. I believe that has been proven unfounded. Like I was saying though--vaccines have not been proven harmful, and the consequences of NOT vaccinating can certainly be devastating. We are also a military family (retired) so we travelled outside CONUS quite often, and not having our children vaccinated would have been neglectful, if not deadly. Just my opinion. I guess as long as your kids will never come into contact with the outside world, fine. But with our country's "open" borders, all sorts of diseases once thought "extinct" (ex: smallpox) are reappearing. Why risk it?
angela
Friday, January 02, 2004 at 13:33:33 (EST)
Cherokee ~ I'll be 30 in August. Whew - that felt weird to type - haven't really faced the fact yet that I will be leaving my 20's... lol.

LH ~ you mean you speed? LOL. My speeding is probably limited to about 5 to 10 over tops, and that depending on where I am driving and weather conditions. LOL. What kind of fast car do you have? I used to have a Mazda 280Z that was pretty fast, although I never used it the way it was meant to - my dh did on one or two occasions and I was pretty scared about him driving it after that. By the way, I don't think you have any envy.... more on that later...
Saraj ~ I have never ever ever called my dd stupid, I am very careful what I do say to her because that sort of stuff can really hurt a child's feelings BEYOND the particular moment it was said. Of course, I only have one child so it may be easier for me to keep my cool than if I had a whole passel of them. I've watched my gf's 3 kids who are 6, 4, and 2 here at my house with my own 2 yr old and I can feel my bp rising... LOL. Um, I do occasionally go slightly over the speed limit. I once ran over a cat by accident, as well as a squirrel by accident. I love animals and would never intentionally hurt them. Picking my nose, well I am not going to say I have never done that because I have been known to take a piece of toilet paper and scrape out an annoying mess - does that count (getting tmi here?). I did shoplift when I was in HS and I got caught and paid the fines myself. Other than that I was a pretty good kid - I drank at a few parties but never drove drunk (and probably only a handful of parties that I can remember), never ever ever did any drugs at all while in HS although I did smoke pot a few times when I was about 19 or 20, didn't see the point so I stopped. I worked from the time I was 15 so I could have my own spending money in HS instead of asking my mom and dad for money. I have shared that my dh is a recovered drug addict. I did share that I have had an abortion. When I was in HS I had a really bad self confidence problem and I used to fib to my friends so that they would be "impressed" by me. I think that is all the skeletons in my closet. I don't have a problem sharing them, I am an open book.
By the way, I think your birth photos are great. They are very graphic but you do give warnings that they are. I am thrilled by birth, and I think these photos are wonderful. I wouldn't put my own (not that we have such graphic ones, hospital wouldnt' allow it) on a website or show them to anyone, but that's me.

AnneL ~ hope I got your name right. I don't know how long you have been posting here, or lurking here, but unless it has been a REALLY long time, I wish you wouldn't come on here and start telling people what kind of personality they have. I didn't realize it was possible to tell what kind of personality a person has from a message forum anyhow, where it is difficult to interpret emotions, facial expressions, etc.

On the topic of vaccines: my daughter is vaccinated and after researching and discussing the pros and cons on my own as well as with my breast feeding support group, I decided it was the responsible thing to do for us as she does interact with other children on a regular basis. If your kids are not in public places and don't come into regular contact with other kids, do what you want.

Gotta run!
Margarita
Friday, January 02, 2004 at 13:33:32 (EST)
Cherokee ~ I'll be 30 in August. Whew - that felt weird to type - haven't really faced the fact yet that I will be leaving my 20's... lol.

LH ~ you mean you speed? LOL. My speeding is probably limited to about 5 to 10 over tops, and that depending on where I am driving and weather conditions. LOL. What kind of fast car do you have? I used to have a Mazda 280Z that was pretty fast, although I never used it the way it was meant to - my dh did on one or two occasions and I was pretty scared about him driving it after that. By the way, I don't think you have any envy.... more on that later...
Saraj ~ I have never ever ever called my dd stupid, I am very careful what I do say to her because that sort of stuff can really hurt a child's feelings BEYOND the particular moment it was said. Of course, I only have one child so it may be easier for me to keep my cool than if I had a whole passel of them. I've watched my gf's 3 kids who are 6, 4, and 2 here at my house with my own 2 yr old and I can feel my bp rising... LOL. Um, I do occasionally go slightly over the speed limit. I once ran over a cat by accident, as well as a squirrel by accident. I love animals and would never intentionally hurt them. Picking my nose, well I am not going to say I have never done that because I have been known to take a piece of toilet paper and scrape out an annoying mess - does that count (getting tmi here?). I did shoplift when I was in HS and I got caught and paid the fines myself. Other than that I was a pretty good kid - I drank at a few parties but never drove drunk (and probably only a handful of parties that I can remember), never ever ever did any drugs at all while in HS although I did smoke pot a few times when I was about 19 or 20, didn't see the point so I stopped. I worked from the time I was 15 so I could have my own spending money in HS instead of asking my mom and dad for money. I have shared that my dh is a recovered drug addict. I did share that I have had an abortion. When I was in HS I had a really bad self confidence problem and I used to fib to my friends so that they would be "impressed" by me. I think that is all the skeletons in my closet. I don't have a problem sharing them, I am an open book.
By the way, I think your birth photos are great. They are very graphic but you do give warnings that they are. I am thrilled by birth, and I think these photos are wonderful. I wouldn't put my own (not that we have such graphic ones, hospital wouldnt' allow it) on a website or show them to anyone, but that's me.

AnneL ~ hope I got your name right. I don't know how long you have been posting here, or lurking here, but unless it has been a REALLY long time, I wish you wouldn't come on here and start telling people what kind of personality they have. I didn't realize it was possible to tell what kind of personality a person has from a message forum anyhow, where it is difficult to interpret emotions, facial expressions, etc.

On the topic of vaccines: my daughter is vaccinated and after researching and discussing the pros and cons on my own as well as with my breast feeding support group, I decided it was the responsible thing to do for us as she does interact with other children on a regular basis. If your kids are not in public places and don't come into regular contact with other kids, do what you want.

Gotta run!
Margarita
Friday, January 02, 2004 at 13:16:34 (EST)

"with you but only if you make yourself out to be holier than thou."

Of course I was joking. HA HA
Riley's Mom
Friday, January 02, 2004 at 13:13:57 (EST)
Wow, I had no idea that this was all going on.
Some of you are really brave and mouthy when you think you are anon.
Saraj, I am intrested in debating vaccines with you but only if you make yourself out to be holier than thou. You seem to have a real attitude that is unnessasary. But I think it would be an interesting topic to discuss like calm and somewhat rational people.

Now LH and I haven't always gotten along in the past, but I have to agree with her that all this has gone on long enough and cooler heads need to prevail. Anna(whoever) LH has been posting here longer than me as well and has proven to have balls more than enough times. Unlike some we know when to call it a day and be done with it.

Now if anyone has a problem with my speaking out, feel free to blast away. I welcome honest and worthwhile debates!
Riley's Mom
Friday, January 02, 2004 at 13:11:44 (EST)
Julie--Hi! I was the one who asked if you were also saraj...so that WASN'T your cervix on the web? ;) Truce? Where did you find that website? Way too cute! I'm Trampy Bear according to Quizilla! LOL! Better than Druggy Bear I guess...

Anna L.--Like your style too girl! Liked the P***S envy insight! Some women react that way with "ballsy chicks." Angela is my real name too.

Cherokee--I think LH agreed everybody ELSE was going to play nice. That did not apply to her..."straying from the pack" like she does and all. LOL!

Kerri--Did hubby need any rescusitation after see you in your "rescusitated" little black dress? wink! wink!

saraj--Nobody got to be an adult without doing one or two things they wish they could take back. That is where many of us gain maturity and wisdom. Some things are indeed "dirty laundry" though, and are better left in a confidential setting. You don't need to put it "all out there" figuratively and literally in order for people to get to know you. There is nothing wrong with having just a bit of class. I'm not poking at you, trying to knock you down a notch, or trying to be nasty...just making a comment. I'm older than you(just a little though!) and have been around the block a few times. Once in a while you have to take a person's comments in the nature intended, and not try to "one-up" everybody simply for shock value. Capiche? Just out of curiosity(and for fun)...which dysfunctional Care Bear would you be? ;)

TC all!
angela
Friday, January 02, 2004 at 13:07:08 (EST)
I'm not trying to butt in or anything but I just realized something when I was doing the dishes...It's kind of weird that Anna L. knew that LH uses the initials of her first and last name. Just an observation.
Julie
Friday, January 02, 2004 at 13:03:46 (EST)
I'm not trying to feed her need for drama...I just thought it was a good excuse to use to talk about myself. ;) Speaking of which, I don't think I ever gave my basic info. I am 28 and have three children with one on the way. Ages 2, 8, and 10. I am just starting my 5th month and have a prenatal check up today. I've been married to my dh for almost five years. He is my second husband. I had my first child and my first husband when I was only a Senior in high school. I am an aspiring writer. I use forums as a way to procrastinate doing more important things in my life. I am also a drama queen and tend to butt into arguements that have nothing to do with me.
Julie
Friday, January 02, 2004 at 12:34:45 (EST)
Oh, one more thing - just because I'm sure I will be singled out since others are responding and if I don't I'll be attacked again - I suppose that because I have made good choices in my life and haven't done any of things you mentioned I am lying right?
I have never: STOLEN, HAD AN AFFAIR, CALLED ANY OF MY CHILDREN STUPID, PICK MY NOSE? (YEAH, MAYBE WHEN I WAS 3 - EWWW!) Since I am an EMT I don't speed, I don't drink and drive (seen the results)Oh wait, I once ran over a rattlesnake in the road with the ambulance I was driving, they are abundant in AZ and it was neighborhood, probably would have bitten someone.

Not everybody has skeletons in their closet. And if they do so what..it has nothing to do really with what you are talking about. Alot of people on this board have shared some pretty personal stuff.

LH - just read your last post. You blast me for telling it like it is, (or how I see it)--someone says their observation (only an observation mind you) and you blast her too. What gives? Thought we agreed to play nice?
Cherokee
Friday, January 02, 2004 at 12:29:40 (EST)
Wiccan is actually a good thing Julie...don't ever be ashamed of that! TC!
LH
Friday, January 02, 2004 at 12:19:47 (EST)
Hi Julie. I think Saraj totally gets off riling people up. She even gloats on it in the last post. Don't feed, it won't grow, right? So if she annoys you the way she annoys me...just pay no mind. I gotta run, the kids are stirring around from their naps and today is my daughter's language arts lesson so off I go...have a good day everyone -

Anna L - do you have kids? How many and how old? I mean that sincerely, everyone on the board has shared a little info :0)

Cherokee
Friday, January 02, 2004 at 12:16:44 (EST)
Oh and BTW, Anna L...I have posted here for a very long time as LH...I have never seen your post until now..humm...but seriously go ahead...put your full correct name and email addy up...I'm sure the nutcases would have a field day with you...I dare you...go for it!
LH
Friday, January 02, 2004 at 12:16:22 (EST)
I am up for a debate on the no vaccines and the unschooling, what is that?? I know there are risks associated with vaccines, however, the risk far outweigh getting these diseases. And another thing, your kids can be carriers of these diseases and passing them since they are not vaccinated. You are putting everyone elses kids at risk, for what? It sounds to me like you hate the government telling you that you * have * to do something, so you do just the opposite, you dont do it, and think you have good reasons for it. Please explain.
Lyne
Friday, January 02, 2004 at 12:13:31 (EST)
I don't feel like cleaning my kitchen so I will humor you about your little request.

I am Wiccan and I keep it secret from everyone at the Baptist church that I attend.
Julie
Friday, January 02, 2004 at 12:13:20 (EST)
Saraj
GET OVER YOUSELF ALREADY!
Julie
Friday, January 02, 2004 at 12:07:54 (EST)
ummm...me either...but SaraJ, I DO SPEED...actually quite often...I have a fast car and I like to go FAST!

Have fun today ladies...especially you Anna LMFAO! :-)
LH
Friday, January 02, 2004 at 12:02:50 (EST)
>I have actually made a few email buddies while posting here. Womyn who emailed me seperately because to support me here in front of some of you, could mean much hurt for her. (Sad, isn't it?)

For the record: I am not one of them.


Julie
Friday, January 02, 2004 at 11:54:26 (EST)
Oh Julie, laughing so hard right now. That was GREAT! How did ya find that website? I took the quiz....I'm RAVER BEAR! So funny. (And right on too...I DO like bright shiny things and stuff that sparkles...and Dh and I do a mean salsa and meringue..but umm, I don't think that is what they had in mind? haha! Thanks!

Nihilist Bearhuh? That was cool.

How come I can't be Bondage Bear? (wink).
Cherokee
Friday, January 02, 2004 at 11:38:33 (EST)
Hey ladies~

I don't HAVE to post here, and I don't have to look here, but actually, I enjoy it. It's always a thrill for me to find womyn such as most of you, who gang up on others like me posting places like this ~and me having a steel backbone, not allowing anyone to "scare me off"...It's something I actually seek out.
You ladies are just giving me thrills. Ofcourse, I am who I say I am. All of my sites, everything, that's really me.
It is nothing but POSITIVE for all of you to see that there are womyn like me in the world. Womyn who are different than you in so many ways. It's good that some of you see that there is life out there other than what you make for yourselves in a high school like setting on some on line message board.

The lady who claims she knows me just happens to fit right in with you. And no, I'm not worried she may know me. She doens't scare me. I know who it is. Trust me, we don't know eachother. She has issues with everyone. There are many people out there like that.

However fun this is for me...I have actually made a few email buddies while posting here. Womyn who emailed me seperately because to support me here in front of some of you, could mean much hurt for her. (Sad, isn't it?)

I'm sticking around...The ladies that come here with views like mine will need support from someone with a steel backbone. I'll be here for her!

PS...I'd like to make a point AND a request. I open much of my life up to places like this...sharing my sites and thoughts. Obviously, it gives fire power to anyone who wants to rip on me, or belittle me. The more you know, the easier that is right? Now, the cuts I get actual keep me stronger, but it would be the opposite for most of you. Correct? I request anyone willing to share something that they would NEVER have THOUGHT of sharing on this board. Open up a little. (Examples: ever tell your kid he was stupid out of rage? Purposely run over an animal in the road? Pick your nose and flick it at a friends house? Have an affair? Steal? Speed ? Drive after a few drinks?) Those are just a mere few...I bet most of you could say yes to at least one of those questions. Can you imagine if you shared that info here, how it would be used against you in a debate?

Now, I am up for any great debate. In fact, I'd be more than happy to start the vaccine debate. (Someone already requested it below) dn I can do it in a mature and respectful manner. Anyone up for the challenge?
Saraj
Friday, January 02, 2004 at 11:38:22 (EST)
Ummm, that was just the answer I would expect from you LH (based on your recent behavior I have watched transpire on this board). YOU don't even use your first and last name Laugh MY Ass off...you only use your initials...Hmmm.
Anna L.
Friday, January 02, 2004 at 11:29:50 (EST)
Anna L...yea right..LMFAO!
At least I still have the ballz to post under my real name here!
LH
Friday, January 02, 2004 at 10:55:27 (EST)
At Quizilla.com you can take a quiz to discover which Dysfuctional Care Bear you are. I'm Nihilist Bear.
Julie
Friday, January 02, 2004 at 10:48:34 (EST)
Wow...going out on a limb posting here. Probably will get cut off at the legs with this post, but here goes:thought we were a country of free speech. While I do think Saraj's website(I visited it) is probably a little TMI(ok alot - she seems pretty full of herself, I have a nice physique even pregnant, but I wouldn't broadcast my husband checking my cervix for any reason, you can educate people without the soft porn shots)lol!

LH - if Cherokee were a guy I would say you had P*&^s envy. She is ballsy, you don't like it. She is probably saying what most people are thinking, but don't feel comfortable saying. Get over it.

Angela-I like your style girl-

Kerri-Again someone I would like to e-meet.

Saraj - we are WAY too different for me to EVER understand you girl! LOL! I can dig the whole flower child thing to a certain extent, but frankly, when off-the-mainstream views concern children, that is where I draw the line...no vaccinations...BAD idea...the incident of adverse reactions is so small (kind of like with chemotherapy-I bet if you had cancer, YOU would take the treatment, even though there is a small percentage of adverse reactions)I don't see how anyone could not protect the most precious thing life gives to us. I notice on your website, you have a link to report adverse reactions. Do you follow up? Do you require these "reports" to follow up with medical evidence and documentation? Exactly what makes you think you are qualified medically to announce this "research" and persuade people to not vaccinate? This is something that has been working for America for over 100 years! You want to see what happends when children are not vaccinated? Do what I did. Do some REAL research and go to country where there aren't any. Like Africa. Like the Middle East. I have been on missions to both, and it is DEVESTATING to see a child crippled with polio or dying from Measles, or countless other childhood diseases. I must say, (and I know you don't care you will probably just spout your fairytale whimsy at me) You Are Scary. I hope most do not follow your example. Seems Saraj THRIVES on controversy, (the whole center stage band thing, broadcasting her, ahem, *cervix* in the name of "art", etc. -not jealous Saraj, as you imply any time someone brings it up-The solution: don't pay her attention.
Anna L.
Friday, January 02, 2004 at 10:36:00 (EST)
Saraj
I had written a big long post but I decided that any further with you isn't worth my time.

TO THE REST OF YOU:
We have better things to talk about than Saraj. Can we possibly discuss something else?

Julie
Friday, January 02, 2004 at 10:19:49 (EST)
Margarita
Thanks for accepting my apology. :) I started posting during the Micheal Jackson question. Any "Julie" before that was a different one.
Julie
Friday, January 02, 2004 at 09:58:17 (EST)
Margarita: Awwww man. Ya make me feel like an old lady LOL!! Care Bears first came out I think the year before or after my first child was born, who is now 20. Just curious - how old are you? (If you don't mind my asking...):0)

Kerri: How was your New Years' Eve?
Cherokee
Friday, January 02, 2004 at 08:45:54 (EST)
Angela ~ My best friend had Strawberry Shortcake and I had (have, at my parents house, my dd plays with her still) the Apricot kisses one. She stills smells like apricots ;-).
Cherokee ~ I knew what care bears were, my dd is not really aware of them yet, but I think they were coming out at a time I was a little old for them. I had never heard that term before though - cute.
Margarita
Friday, January 02, 2004 at 02:38:44 (EST)
Saraj-
"We practice extended breastfeeding, bed sharing, unschooling, no vaccines, and
more! We raise our children pro-choice and religion free."

What does all this mean? What is "UNSCHOOLING"...and what do you hope you gain by raising your children without morals by instructing them to be "pro-choice" and not have any sort of religion? I feel for your S.O.
Please explain so I may understand more about your "lifestyle" in case I come across someone like you in my job...and don't even get me started on the "no vaccines" part...

To everyone else, sorry, but I have had a rough enough day at work dealing with ignorant people than to read more of "SARAJ"'s comments...and did you check out that website??? OMG. And her link to the ultra feminist who believes that children are HER "possession" and NOT her "mates" (since her views of marriage are just as pathetic and she refused to have children with this "man" until he understood that the kids would be "HER" property and NOT HIS at all! It really is sad to think there really are people out in the world like this...I feel mostly for the children. SARAJ-are you like the womAn whose link you sent out in your website?
Kerri
Friday, January 02, 2004 at 01:00:04 (EST)
Saraj...I know this is none of my business and you could very well tell me to butt out...but I really feel the need to speak my piece here and maybe...just maybe my advice will be taken in a *good* way as it is intended!

I am sure you are very proud of your birth choices and of your family...I am also sure you are proud of your website and your band! But why do you feel the need to keep coming on here and defending yourself to these people...basically "digging a deeper hole for yourself" as I really feel they will only continue to poke fun and make snide remarks! (well, most...not all!)

And now...just tonight I see a post from someone who says she lives near you...someone who you apparently might possibly know...and someone who, might possibly wish to do you or your family harm! Aren't you just abit leary?

The internet can be a very useful tool...also alot of lasting friendships made here...BUT...there is a dark side to it too... I won't go into my own personal story here...but I learned to become VERY cautious about what I post anymore and where! There are alot of crazy people on the net nowadays...you really HAVE to be careful about what info you give out, how much, and to whom!!

Well...this is probably good advice for anyone to follow...and, just my thoughts...

TC!!
LH
Thursday, January 01, 2004 at 23:00:38 (EST)
Joyce~ (what's your real name~I don't know a Joyce, and you know me so well.)

I am not one to normally go out of my way to defend myself, but since this is so close to home, I thought I'd clear this up.

Yes, I have accepted donations from our area for Christmas before. We had a son born with TGA (a severe heart defect) in 1998, and we are still paying for the medical bills, since we aren't on any state help. However, we also generously donate to the local food pantry~the ladies know my family and I by name and adore my children. Oh, and we even donate working tv's and microwaves to the same place who gives out the holiday boxes, since my husband owns a repair shop.

Yes, I tan...only during the winter months, mostly for the rays, to help prevent the winter blahs. I pay for my tanning packages in small payments.

My daughter IS in dance. We get our classes for free. Why? Because we do the video taping and editing for every year's recital. It's a great deal.

I am thinking "Joyce" DOES know me. But is only going by what she wants to see.

My older children swear once in awhile. We don't allow it...but we also don't freak out about it. It's amazing how many parents think thier children never swear.

"Joyce"...are you the person who is removing my puppy sale ads? Are you the one who placed a nasty sticker on one of my signs, saying I have a puppy mill? I am betting anything it's you. Maybe you should just be a good person and come and talk to me. Don't hide behind a phoney name and list false information about someone without being 100% sure. It's not polite.

My band. It's still going! :-) We have merely taken a break to record some originals. (Do I sense a bit of jealousy "Joyce"?)

I'm proud of all I have accomplished..I am proud of my kids, and my life.

So, Joyce, are you going to "come out of the closet?" Can't wait to meet you!

_____

To answer Margarita's question...(I hope is was from her, I can't see from here)

Yes, unassisted means at home with just the family. No medical interventions at all.
(No pain killers...nothing.)



Saraj
Thursday, January 01, 2004 at 21:13:44 (EST)
Geez..obviously didn't proof my post..sorry for the grammar!
Cherokee
Thursday, January 01, 2004 at 20:21:45 (EST)
Angela! - Hey...I did exactly what I said I was gonna...I watched Law And Order (SVU) reruns until midnite lol! Listened to the fireworks outside and was asleep my 12:30...also DH got up with the kids and I slept until 10:30 which was great. I have literally been doing laundry all day...and my income projections for my two businesses. Doesn't that sound exciting? Maybe DH will go rent Seabiscuit tonite..I'm gonna have to check that one out.

Ohh...still got my Dressy Bessy! :0)
Cherokee
Thursday, January 01, 2004 at 20:20:05 (EST)
Cherokee--oops! Almost forgot ya! Hola mi amiga! How was your New Year's Eve. Ours was very exciting~watched a movie, ate junk food, were all tucked into bed by 10:00 and slept through the entrance of the New Year! :)
angela
Thursday, January 01, 2004 at 20:02:51 (EST)
Margarita--We watched "Seabiscuit" last night~I agree with you. It was a VERY good movie! :) I still have a Care Bear from my stuffed animal/doll collection I kept all the way through College. It's is a box of collectibles my mom has at her home. Anybody remember Strawberry Shortcake? My eight year old is completely in to her~she's made a comeback too. I'm waiting for Holly Hobby to reappear now! Anybody remember her? How about Dressy Bessy? My sisters used to play with Polly Pockets too, and our daughter just got a Polly Pocket tree house for her birthday, and a Polly Pocket pet shop from Santa. I love playing with her toys! TC all!
angela
Thursday, January 01, 2004 at 20:00:25 (EST)
You're little one probably isn't watching Care Bears yet. It was very popular about 20 years ago, went dead and is now making a huge comeback. (kind of like Helllo Kitty) It's a cute cartoon. There are different bears to represent different emotions and actions (no pissy bears though...it's all positive lol) My daughter got the Share Bear for Christmas.
Anyhoo..whenever someone in the cartoon is feeling low or a couple of care bears are arguing or frightend...they all pitchin and focus their little eyes on the subject...and shoot out this rainbow thing of love and the subject feels better. It's cute.
Cherokee
Thursday, January 01, 2004 at 19:50:03 (EST)
Cherokee - you're right - we have all done the same thing: if you look far enough back none of us are guilt free ;-) which is why I tried to make it clear I was only using your post because it was convenient.

Yes! Let's move on! What is a care bear stare anyhow?? Now you have me very curious!!!
Margarita
Thursday, January 01, 2004 at 19:38:40 (EST)
Julie ~ that was really nice of you to apologize. Have you been posting on here for a very long time? I was curious because when I was looking through the archives I saw a Julie and it sounded like it may have been the same person - you ;-).

Saraj ~ I visited your website - your daughter (I am assuming the little black and white snap shot next to her birth story is her) is very pretty. By unassisted births do you mean drug free? If not, what exactly does it mean - or were you referring only to the one at home?

Hope you all had a great first day of 2004! I cleaned in my attic and visited with my nephew, husband and daughter. My sister in law and her husband are on their way back and we are havign dinner together here.
By the way, if any of you haven't seen Seabiscuit, it is a really good movie.
Margarita
Thursday, January 01, 2004 at 19:33:49 (EST)
The spelling "Saraj" and the nature of the rhetoric sounded like the woman in our little town. When she posted the band (which is defunct and broken up now) website, I knew for sure it was her. She's the ultimate among bad "stage moms" (our daughters are in dance together), her children kow-tow when she's in a bad mood and have incredibly foul mouths (they love the f-word). She openly describes religion as "fairytale BS" but was first in line to pick up an Easter food basket at the church last spring. I understand that times get tough. But when times are tough enough to require food donations, most responsible parents give up their sessions at the tanning salon. Not this one. There isn't much of anyone in town who doesn't know who and what she is. It was nice to see that the women in this forum picked up on it quickly.
Joyce
Thursday, January 01, 2004 at 19:00:51 (EST)
Julie~

When you start feeling defensive about everything someone says, it's time to sit back and take a deep breath. If you take me telling another mom she is a great parent, that I am saying you are not...well, it's just not right. If how you raise your family, and the choices you make for yourself and for them, makes you feel good, safe, and satisfied, I firmly believe you would not be so defensive when issues such as these come up.


Saraj
Thursday, January 01, 2004 at 18:56:31 (EST)
Saraj
Sure maybe YOU weren't worried...Why are you calling homebirthmom awesome and a great mother? Are those of us who have had hospital births with drugs somehow inferior? Are we not awesome and great mothers also?
Julie
Thursday, January 01, 2004 at 18:24:45 (EST)
Homebirthmomma6~YOU are AWESOME. Congrats on being a great mommy.

Do I dare? Here's another website...my band...Lemon Skweezer...

www.lemonskweezer.com
saraj
Thursday, January 01, 2004 at 14:11:13 (EST)
Julie~

I wasn't worried about being told I was someone else. And if I were, do you think explaining it to some of the womyn would work? There is actually a person who posts here that thinks my website and births are fake. Even when there is proof, there is not believing. And personally, my time is much too valuable to waste on trying to explain things that really don't matter. I like to spend my time expalaining things that matter a lot.



Saraj
Thursday, January 01, 2004 at 14:08:25 (EST)
Okay, I wasn't going to be pushy about me not being Saraj, but then I visited her website. Please, please do not assume that I am the same person. I do not want anyone here to think that my children are "unschooled, without religion, ect." I certainly don't want you to think that was my husband and my cervix! lol All of my children were born in a hospital and two were induced for goodness sakes! Please stop saying I am Saraj!
Julie
Thursday, January 01, 2004 at 13:30:27 (EST)
Dear Everyone
You probably won't accept my apology but I'm going to try anyway. I was a complete jerk the other day. I acted like a complete "troll" and 2 year old and you all have every right to be disgusted with me.
I am truly very sorry.

As for me being Saraj, if you want to believe that, there is nothing I can do about it. I can see how you would get that impression, but I am not one and the same. The fact that she is not doing anything to clear up this misunderstanding is a little upsetting to me.

I am sad to see that others are arguing with each other now. Don't worry, I'll keep out of this one.

I hope everyone had a safe and Happy New Year!
Julie
Thursday, January 01, 2004 at 12:41:07 (EST)
Happy New Year to ALL of you! :-)




Saraj
Thursday, January 01, 2004 at 12:12:09 (EST)
LH-"Please don't give me any reasons to either?" Ooooooh-- O.K. Xena!
lol!
angela
Thursday, January 01, 2004 at 11:24:04 (EST)
Hi, new here.... actually I read alot but have never posted.... and no I'm not a troll nor am I trying to start anything.... I do not want to "defend" anyone or anything like that....
I have been reading some stuff that I wanted to comment on... now first off, I am NOT , in any way whatsoever, defending or "going on" saraj or julie's side.... but someone asked about the extended breastfeeding, "unschooling" and no vaccines.... I am a proud mom to six kids,my first five were hospital births and my sixth was what is called unassisted homebirth ... it was just me and my family here... and let me tell ya, if I had known just how awesome it was, I would have had all my kids here at home.... we had a "backup" plan so if there were any "problems", we would know what to do... most people who home, or unassisted birth, research before they do it.
I also breastfeed, and practice "extended" breastfeeding.... basically there is no general rule for this... you naturally let the child decide when to wean... most do it anywhere between 18 months and 3 yrs. Some people take this beyond *my cousin let her son nurse till 4 1/2... little too long for me but thats just my opinion*
About the "unschooling" I have heard of this, and from what I have read about it, it is similar to the Montesorri type schooling only at home... there are no "set" rules or times when the child has to do anything. They make everything during the day into a learning experience. They don't "sit down" at desks to do work, etc. Just another type of schooling really, just a weird name for it. Really people call it that because they are so against the "traditional" schooling that they want even the name of what they are doing to be far away from anything "school".
I have read that most on here are for vaccinating children and have even gone as far as saying those who dont are foolish and the reason some things are "coming back". I had my first four completely vaccinated and my fifth child a few of the shots. My sixth tho, has had no vaccines and I do not plan to do so either. I have done extensive research on this before I made the decission. I have read many reports and research papers from doctors , medical journals, and even the CDC. My decision was not based on any foolish whim or anything else like that. I can tell you that out of my six children, the one that is non vaccinated is the healthiest by far... and out of the kids in my area who have had such things as whooping cough , the ones who got it WERE vaccinated... the non vacs kids never got sick... so to those who think that the ones not vaccinated are the ones who spread it, please do more research on the facts... I did.
Now I doubt that I will be back on for a while*kids are keeping me busy..lol*, so dont be surprised if I dont answer to anyone... I am not trying to be rude, just wont be on for a while. Hope you all have a great new year.

homebirthmom6
Thursday, January 01, 2004 at 02:07:26 (EST)
Okie dokie. Honestly if I've offended a few here and I am willing to say "sorry"...I don't believe that I'm behaving any differently than anyone else, including a few who have used me as examples ***the last two or three, maybe four times***But...I know the spirit in which I say something...I think everybody just needs a "care bear stare" as my daughter would say...can we please just move on? Please?
Cherokee
Thursday, January 01, 2004 at 00:36:37 (EST)
Cherokee - I'm not saying that you are the cause of this board getting more antagonistic - only that it HAS gotten more antogonistic and I used your post because it was fresh in my mind and it was handy and it served my purpose. Certainly if I looked far enough down (or not far at all in this topic's case) I could have come up with other pertinent posts to use.
I think we did use to have the fun, differing of opinions that you are talking about where everybody respects the other still (with some exceptions) on this board at one time - I have some very different opinions than Goodwin does for example, but have always enjoyed her posts and debating with her in a good natured way that was fun and educational. I wouldn't have hesitated to be her email buddy. But some of the posts that are being left lately are so mean natured that I don't get the impression that I could, or someone else could, for that matter, be email friends with some of the people. I can' even think of anything off the top of my head. It's sort of like my real friends - lol - some of them make me feel really positive, and that is how I used to feel after a debate on this board, and now I often feel like I've been spending too much time with the friends of mine who bring out my more gossipy side. Does that make sense? Again, I am not directing this at any one in particular, I don't think it has occured because of one person only a general disregard for people's feelings by all of us in addition to perhaps a different quality of debate topics, the fact that they are left on so long people get bored and more off topic, a lot of pot stirrers dropping in, etc.
Ok, my dh is waiting for me to come watch movies with him now.
Catch you all later.
Margarita
Thursday, January 01, 2004 at 00:16:58 (EST)
No angela...I'm not "launching an attack" on anyone here...please don't give me any reasons to either! I think we all are entitled to our opinions...so you disagree with mine...OK!
LH
Wednesday, December 31, 2003 at 23:53:45 (EST)
O.K. LH--point taken. Getting a bit irrational for a bunch of "people just posting on the same board" aren't you? Are you going to launch an attack at ME now since I dared to disagree with you? Is it "debating" only when your opinion differs from someone elses? You don't post much of anything for how long? And then you come back just to launch a nasty assault at another poster here (and anybody else who disagrees with you?) That is hypocritical.
angela
Wednesday, December 31, 2003 at 23:27:23 (EST)
Good post margarita :-)

Cherokee...since my first post here tonight you have told me to "grow up"...that I'm too "PC"...I am a "shrinking violet"...I am "intimidated"...I am a "hypocrite"...I am "dark, gloomy, and angry"...and I make "hastly judgements"...in that order!! All that because I had an opinion that you seemed to me to be abit controlling of the board! Jeez!
LH
Wednesday, December 31, 2003 at 23:07:50 (EST)
Margarita- You are right. I did retaliate with the Baily's comment because I felt that I was personally attacked. It was harsh. But then, so was she. I have a problem with hypocrites singling me out, EVERYONE on this board has been in someone's face at one time or another..seems like what is being implied is since I'VE joined the board, there have been problems? I mean I could be wrong - I don't understand what the deal is with LH, she had I have corresponded frequently and now she is all dark, and gloomy and angry. Maybe a little Christmas thing I don't know.

I do want to say, that she DID twist what I said, I never said because she didn't agree with me (I thought everyone was in agreement about a few topics lately) that she was "weak", I don't think my posts were read thoroughly and she was maybe a little hasty in her judgement..I DID say, it was like she was taking a "shrinking violet" attitude (different then being a shrinking violet) because she was acting as though I was strong in an area that I was the "Dominatrix".

LH - The line: BTW - we are not e-friends or whatever that is..Got it. Loud and clear. Still wish ya the best with your illnes.

I guess because I am new here I don't have as much right to "speak up"? My misconception, sorry. I belong to several other boards and discuss similar topics, some much more heated LOL! and...we disagree *loudly* sometimes, but we are still friends. No one has ever complained. In fact, we privately e-mail each other all the time and send e-cards and though we wildly disagree on stuff, we are still friends.
Cherokee
Wednesday, December 31, 2003 at 20:42:55 (EST)
angela...I DO stray from the pack and it is not a perception...but you may perceive what you want...I have nothing to prove here! I did, however, take offense to a few posts that cited JMO's leaving to be childish..so I left my opinion...WOI!!

cherokee...I really wish you had proved me wrong...but you didn't, so...oh well! You don't think I'm "educated" or "strong" now because I disagree or have a different perception of the board? See...that's what I mean...if someone comes on and posts something that YOU disagree with...YOU try to knock them down a notch or to make them feel "uneducated" or whatever you can find to throw in there! That's not right...this board is not "right" anymore!

BTW...we are not "efriends" whatever the heck that is...and I never asked for a thing from you when I had my little "pity party" as you called it! You and I are just two people posting on the same board...I read your posts...even enjoy some of them...but for the most part, I think you are very controlling of this board...just my thoughts tho...
LH
Wednesday, December 31, 2003 at 20:25:22 (EST)
Hey LH, hi guys. Angela sparked my interest so I went back into some of the archives as well (hey what can I say, too much time on my hands today). I looked at the following topics if any of you are interested to have a look: 6/24/03, 6/3/03, 5/20/03, 12/31/02, 3/05/02.
Anyhow, other than the December one, there were very few personal attacks or real "barbed" comments made. I think I read about 1 or 2 on average per topic. That is indeed quiet a bit different than what has been going on here lately. If you want some entertainment though - read through the Dec one - wowza. I think we have all been guilty of bringing this about. I myself have ripped into Oscar a few times in a very disrespectful manner. Most of the posts from the archived topics were pretty respectful and very little name calling or bad language.
Anyhow, I like all you ladies who regularly post here. I have learned from all of you and have received support from all of you - especially LH this last summer.
Cherokee, I don't want you to think I am singling you out, but yours was the last post before I started this, so I am going to use it as an example - Baily's Pity Party - I'm not sure how you meant it but it sounds pretty rough. I cringed when I read it because I don't even remember LH being mean to anyone at that time, she was just feeling blue, so why was it used as an example? It didn't sound much like an opinion, just mean. Like I said, we are ALL guilty of doing this at one time or another. I can't think of one person on this board who hasn't had a little flaming going on, but it does seem more prevelant lately. I don't know if it is the topics, or the length of time they are staying posted, or an increase in the number of trolls and pot stirrers or what, but something has gotten into us and we are not treating each other with the same amount of respect I just read in the archives.
I am not saying we all have to agree with everyone's opinions here - I mean what is this board for eh? And I love debating things with other adults in a productive manner, even if I don't ever change someone's mind.
Well, my dh is home from work now, and I guess I should make some dinner. Happy New Years to you all - hope you all arrive to your destinations safely and don't feel too partied out tomorrow. We are staying in for the night and celebrating it alone as a family.
Margarita
Wednesday, December 31, 2003 at 20:10:38 (EST)
LH? What the heck? What was that? I thought we were e-friends?? I guess not. Wow. Did you *thoroughly* read my last posts? How would you like it if everyone wanted to kick you off when you had your Bailey's pity party a few weeks back. Please grow up! This sounds like highschool stuff - you don't like someone else taking charge of a conversation so I'm manipulative huh? I know alot about a subject and I say so, but if it is intimidating to others, I should not speak up so as not to make others feel inferior? How PC. Come on! You struck me as an educated strong person, not a shrinking violet!

Geez, Yeah I'm opinioniated and educated and not afraid to say so, or argue with someone who blatently displays incorrect facts - so what? There are not children present here - we are all adults capable of pissing each other off and then moving on to the next topic. What is a debate for? At least I don't pull the Julie thing...I think I'm an alpha female that is for sure and to other people that is intimidating. Although I have never thought of myself like that. This is not shouting ...just emphasizing: I ACKNOWLEDGE THAT OTHERS HAVE THEIR OPINION, EVEN SARAJ/JULIE WITH WHOM *YOU* HAVE BEEN CONFRONTATIONAL WITH AS WELL. I NEVER have discouraged anyone from saying anything and I think we both know that. Happy New Year. I don't think I should have to censor what I write.
Cherokee
Wednesday, December 31, 2003 at 18:38:53 (EST)
Hi LH! Nice to "see" you again. :) I need to ask though--why is it that if people share and agree on an opinion/thought/belief they are following the "leader of the pack." But, if YOU jump in with an opinion, after quite a long period (for you) of not participating on the board, to defend YOUR friends you are strong/brave and "straying from the pack?" What is the difference other than your perception?
I think people were responding to the "dramatic" exit of other poster's off this board, and calling the "packing their toys and leaving the sandbox" mentality childish. I never thought anybody was being called anything derogatory, such as "childish", in a personal fashion. They can speak for themselves though if I'm wrong.
Also--people here can "opinionate" when, and about, whatever they want too. If several of us share an opinion that does not necessarily connotate a "pack" mentality. Play Nice~~Goodness!!
angela
Wednesday, December 31, 2003 at 17:50:12 (EST)
I really hated to read that another poster (JMO) has decided to leave...BUT what I hated the most was that some of you felt the need to "opinionate" about it and call it childish! Why could you not have just wished her well and let that be it??

This board has changed alot over the last couple of months...I'm not saying it is all bad, but I don't think its all that good either!!!

From what I can see of the place...the "leader of the pack" so to speak is CHEROKEE and if one of you is so bold to disagree or have a different opinion than she...well...LOOK OUT!! Personally I liked it better when everyone had their own thoughts and opinions and were not afraid to voice them! As for myself...I have always strayed from the pack and as indicated...still am not afraid to speak my mind!

I have decided to keep posting here...on occassion...when I see a topic that interests me and feel the need to voice an opinion on it...or debate it with others, if that is still possible here! I wish JMO and GOODWIN would reconsider too as they BOTH had something to add and I feel were very important contributers to this board!!!SO if you happen to see this ladies...please reconsider as you both will be sadly missed!!

I guess you'll just have to put up with me for awhile gang...you know I've always called it just as I see it... and I'm sure this post won't go over very well with some...maybe I just felt the need to say what others didn't!

At any rate...I just wanted to also wish everyone a HAPPY and SAFE NEW YEARS...Lord only knows this year has gotten quite OLD and I, pesonally, am looking forward to the NEW!!! TC!!
~*2004*~
LH
Wednesday, December 31, 2003 at 16:44:09 (EST)
I wish everyone a happy & healthy new year! And, best of luck to all the pregnant mommies on here too :)
Lyne
Wednesday, December 31, 2003 at 14:40:05 (EST)
Hahaha...Oh Kerri - You GO GIRL!! (wink wink). Knock 'em dead! Your little peanut will be fine. Hubby called a little while ago and he is bringing steaks home (beer for him juice for me;)--we are hoping we conceived this month (I ovulated 4 days ago) and since we MAY be pg, we are doing it by the book. That will be our big evening. Can anyone recommend any good videos (clean ones folks! we're Christians over here LOL)
Cherokee
Wednesday, December 31, 2003 at 13:23:39 (EST)
Believe it or not, I am resusitating my black dress! We are going to a gala at a hotel with friends and staying the night. Thank goodness for wonderful in-laws who are daring to have the first sleepover with our toddler! Wish us luck for the first night away!

Kerri
Wednesday, December 31, 2003 at 13:14:14 (EST)
Hey Angela! LOL! My "slinky" clothes are still in my closet, getting pretty lonely in there...:0)

Since you were talking about partying hard..my SILs are both single and in their mid 40's and are planning big stuff for tonite. My SIL asked me if I wanted to come out with them (leave hubby home with the kiddies). She said and I Quote..."it would do you good to put on some cute clothes and some makeup" I almost kicked her *&^! LOL! They are so anti-homemaker. I usually wear my long hair in a pony tail or braid (the babies yank it out if I don't) and t-shirts w/jeans or long skirts. They ASSUME I never get wild (wink)Guess I am a boring old mommy to them. (sigh)oh well. I am with you - I wouldn't have it any other way!!
Cherokee
Wednesday, December 31, 2003 at 11:41:08 (EST)
J-MO: I wish you wouldn't leave but certainly understand that when things get too irritating some people just need to remove themselves from the situation. Believe it or not, {{LOL}}I have actually refrained :0) from making several comments on this board. There are a few folks here who I think we all are pretty sure are complete frauds, and I personally don't like it when people think they have "gotten one over" on me. So Ilike to call 'em on it. Like the troll who was full of inuendo that she was doing my husband. She was all mysterious like she knew me...Wasn't that hilarious?? I let my hubby read those posts and he about died laughing. But then he was all serious and said "You don't believe that do ya?" So funny. Also, there are a lot of different personalities on the board, some are peacekeepers, some people are instigators (not in a negative way, I mean thought-provoking) and some people have the mentality to just tell like it is or how they see it. Saraj and Julie or Saraj/Julie, whichever, I hate to admit, have provided some good debate material, however frustrating they are, and it is entertaining. It does however, get really annoying when they resort to the crap Julie pulled yesterday. That is what convinces me she is really Saraj. If J-mo and others have left because myself and a few other people on this board have called others on their fraud or nastiness, why can't you just *look away*? Take a break from the board for a couple of days? I have. I KNOW you aren't supposed to feed the trolls, especially when I am the one who said it but damnit all, sometimes they just poke ya the right way! LOL! :0)I will try harder to IGNORE them. I'm SURE alot of people ignore me too. ;)I've used this as an example before: I have butted heads with Oscar about weight loss, and Philbert when I insulted Canada (;0)), but I also respect alot of things they have to say, and I think they are pretty cool guys. I don't get why people can't disagree on stuff, argue about it, and then move on? It's kind of high school.

I agree with Kerri, I think it is too bad when people decide they must go away "never to post again"...I have read A GOODWIN's previous posts and J-mo's, you both have important and I think interesting things to say. Hope you will reconsider.

Hey Angela, Esai (aka Mr. Big Stuff );) is looking pretty good, pink eye looks about gone. Unfortunately, it screwed up the daycare for the week, although I don't mind the time off. I painted the laundry room yesterday. Big fun. Any New Year's plans anyone? I'm hoping I can just stay awake until midnite...maybe I'll watch Law and Order reruns. I was BIG pg last year and missed it! Have a beautiful (and loving) day everyone!:0)
Cherokee
Wednesday, December 31, 2003 at 11:36:43 (EST)
Kerri & PJB--I agree!
Happy New Year to everybody! Anybody with big plans tonight? We (hubby & I) are planning a big night of video movies and unhealthy junk food with our three favorite little people tonight. AAAHHH--I remember going out in that "little black dress" with the make-up and high heels partying hardy and bringing in the New Year. What's that Johnson's Baby commercial say? "Having a baby changes everything?" Hubby and I are so boring! I wouldn't have it any other way either!;) TC all!
angela
Wednesday, December 31, 2003 at 11:22:49 (EST)
Good morning everyone...Happy last day of 2003. I don't know about you, I am looking forward to ending this year.
To those who are leaving the board. I guess I really don't understand the "drama" in your decision. I have been posting on and off here for about a year now and if there is a topic I don't like or don't have anything to add, I don't. Pure and simple. But to state you are leaving forever sounds silly becuase what if next month there is a topic interesting or dear to your heart and you would like to contribute...you can't...unless you take a new name. Just ignore what you don't like and add when you feel like it. Making statements like that can be compared to a playground with children saying "I am never going to play with you again"...only to rejoin the group again a few days later. Lets grow up and be adults here.
And with that note. If you drink DO NOT DRIVE!

Kerri
Wednesday, December 31, 2003 at 10:55:25 (EST)
On on a more "cynical" note to the below, so many posters here complain when the topic of the week is "fluff" with no depth and in the same breath complain that a multi faceted toothy topic is too "heated". If you dont like it dont post, leave everyone else to discuss as they wish and ignore the ones that get under your skin. Sheesh....

PJB
Wednesday, December 31, 2003 at 10:47:35 (EST)
Good morning everyone! :) First...j-mo, and AGoodwin know that I love Ya!! I just read your post j-mo and I had to add my two cents. I too have been posting here for quite a while, and I went back in the archives last night and looked at some of our old "debates." In all honesty, a lot of them appeared to be bickering and snarky with a lot of finger pointing, hurt feelings, and not much "debating." That's what happens when "heated" topics get discussed, and let's all be honest here...It can be FUN and invigorating! Also, troublemakers and trolls have popped up on a regular basis, but they do not tend to stick around long. If you go far enough back you will see where Viewer, Oscar, and duke made their first appearances (sorry to be using you guys as examples!) They appeared to be "trouble makers" too, and have turned out to be regular posters hear with interesting points of view. In all honesty, I came on as a percieved trouble maker here too many months ago, and now feel I have made some good friends on this site. What I am getting at is this...I enjoy this site, and I enjoy many people I have "e-met" here, and there is no way in the world that a few random "trolls" are going to run me off, and keep me from posting on a board that I enjoy. As long as a few of "mi amigas" are still here, so too will I be here. I'm not going anywhere, and I would love to see j-mo and AGoodwin stick around too! JMHO. ;)
Now saraj...You are entitled to put up any website you wish. However, if you are going to be "testifying" to the use of (or in this case not using) medical procedures, you need to be honest and factual. Especially if you are trying to fool people into buying your birthing tapes. For one thing...that baby may have been 10+ pounds on your site, but he was NOT a newborn. If he was born at that weight and without medical intervention why is his head such a perfect little shape? Why does he not have the pressure point "angel kisses" on his eyelids and forehead? Also, was it necessary to have a picture of your husband "checking your cervix" on the web? What was the point of that? You're a fraud baby! If I have anything to do with it, NOBODY will be buying your fraudelant (and overpriced) birthing tapes either. Oh--was that a bowl of POPCORN by that so called birthing tub? I stand by my opinion---you are a wierdo/psycho. If your little imaginary friend Julie
doesn't like it...she can bring it on! This is a legitimate board, for serious parents. You've made your point (though inaccurate) so you can vamos now! B'bye sweetie.
TC all, and hang in there. I am. :)
angela
Wednesday, December 31, 2003 at 10:07:46 (EST)
I just went and checked out sarahj's site as well. No vaccines? Im all for breastfeeding ( totally another topic ), but what age is she talking? Til the kid decides its time to stop? She makes it sound like its normal for a school-age child to be brestfeeding ( not that she said that, just what she makes it sound like, thats all ) unschooling? What the heck is that? So now her kids are unvaccinated AND uneducated as well? Is this person for real? So if you are reading, sarahj, please explain WHY the NO vaccines and what is UNschooling?
Lyne
Wednesday, December 31, 2003 at 08:32:45 (EST)
j-mo: =( sorry. Hope I didn't contribute too much to your decision. I'll miss you.
Margarita
Wednesday, December 31, 2003 at 00:10:35 (EST)
well since A.GOODWIN got such a negative response when she posted about leaving this board, i wasn't going to officially say goodbye. however, i think i have made some friends here and i wanted to let them know that i have chosen not to post any more.

it's really sad, but the healthy debates that we once had here have just been overwhelmed by silly bickering, by "trolls" just looking for a fight. we talked over and over about ignoring the blatant trouble makers, but we just can't seem to get past the nonsense.

not trying to attack anyone here, and i'm CERTAINLY not claiming to be above anyone here.

so to all my posting buddies, it has been fun. i hope you all have a wonderful 2004 with many blessings to your family.

take care.......
bye
j-mo
Tuesday, December 30, 2003 at 23:50:48 (EST)
Hi LH!!! Hope you are well sweetie!
Margarita
Tuesday, December 30, 2003 at 21:20:45 (EST)
OMG! This place is a riot! I never saw so much BS all in one place...I've got to admit that it IS a good read! :-)

cameragirl...sorry I have been MIA...been busy and just not much to add here anymore! Glad you enjoyed your trip to the Mason area...so do you think you'll give it a shot?

TC all and play nice!
LH
Tuesday, December 30, 2003 at 19:40:02 (EST)
Danke Troll
curious
Tuesday, December 30, 2003 at 18:56:03 (EST)
Curious, you rock! Thank you for saying what the PC fascists would have you locked up for daring to utter.....the truth. Notice I am naming myself so the PC Reichsleiters don't have to waste time calling me one.
troll
Tuesday, December 30, 2003 at 18:51:38 (EST)
Just noticed something...to the girl who misspells "womyn"...did you know that it is the "Y" chromosome that makes a male male? You give yourself even less credit with your spelling! Idiot Feminist!
curious
Tuesday, December 30, 2003 at 18:34:21 (EST)
Better than "Womyn"...
curious
Tuesday, December 30, 2003 at 18:28:02 (EST)
That's Indian WOMAN idiot!:0)

Your education (or lack of) is evident. :0)
Cherokee
Tuesday, December 30, 2003 at 18:26:18 (EST)
Indian girl...I am not a "troll"...I am an edumakated man!
curious
Tuesday, December 30, 2003 at 18:15:19 (EST)
*****PLEASE EVERYBODY DON'T FEED THE "CURIOUS" TROLL!*******
Cherokee
Tuesday, December 30, 2003 at 17:26:37 (EST)
HELLO....TROLL ALERT!
Cherokee
Tuesday, December 30, 2003 at 17:25:25 (EST)
The fact that this "Kwanzaa" thing is not even related to religion makes it ridiculous that it is even mentioned at this time of year...like Christmas or Hannukah. And to have the children sing songs about it at their schools makes little sense.
I vote to have a new holiday called WASP Day...a day to celebrate all we have made this great country without the help of those of lesser intelligence and ability level due to their race. We have done a lot with this country...just compare us to every other nation out there! Go USA!
curious
Tuesday, December 30, 2003 at 17:23:26 (EST)
One more thing I just gotta say Saraj - one of your kids was born with a heart defect? Would this be the gross deformity that warrants the abortions you spoke of? Hmmm?
Cherokee
Tuesday, December 30, 2003 at 17:21:17 (EST)
K, just visited Saraj's website..that is no 10.9 lbs baby!! Now I totally get it!! She is trying to promote this look-I-had-a 10lb baby without meds anti-establishment anti-hospital policy ("notice the bed is not broken down") blah blah blah. I dunno about you Kerri - but I'm onto this chicadee. I have delivered and assisted in deliveries of MANY children, that was no almost-11lb baby. (I have had to guesstimate many weights of babies delivered in the field)AND ummm, that looked (they all looked) like a VERY assisted delivery AND: correction, Leboyer birth is where the birth actually occurs while mom completely submerged minus her head and shoulders in a tub of water, not birthing a baby in a bed and then letting it "kick" and frolic in the water afterbirth. Geez if you are going to promote official birthing terminology (especially if you want to be a MIDWIFE) on a website at least be accurate.

I am on to you cookie. LOL you are not fooling anyone here. As I aid, have you looked into communes? I mean, if you want to live your own twisted way of looking at things cool - but quit promoting it in an inaccurate fashion.

I'm sure Saraj/Julie will now respond with some utopian view of why can we all just live and let live etc, blah blah blah or Julie will have her typical hissy-fit. Having said that, I will make it a policy to IGNORE.
Cherokee
Tuesday, December 30, 2003 at 17:20:01 (EST)
Please everyone...this is just too weird. Can we just make a collective decision to ignore the Julie-Saraj persona?

Kerri-I agree. After working in a hospital very close to Hopi indian reservation (where shots are FREE they just don't get them) I cannot believe that people don't immunize their kids!! They cannot seriously think it is some huge government conspiracy to control the decisions parents make with their children? It is for a child's own protection that we immunize them against these diseases that have killed so many. Radical liberals...man. If my daycare kids aren't immunized they are OUTTA HERE! I have already turned away one young mom and her husband who have two kids under the age of 4 who have never been immunized. They think they are going to public school too! They said they would "sue" if they weren't allowed in my daycare - I said go for it. Nothing ever happened. When one of her kids gets Measles and ends up dead or deaf she will probably blame the government for that too. How can you claim to have "wanted babies" in one breath then state you don't immunize them and not protect them in the next? People like this maybe should live in a commune so that if they want to expose their kids to the awful childhood epidemics, it will only effect them!
Cherokee
Tuesday, December 30, 2003 at 17:05:24 (EST)
Sarahj-I too must agree with the forum regarding your statements. You state you want to help bring lives into the world, yet can, without guilt mind you, state that the two children you aborted were better off dead since they were "unwanted".
Saraj-you state in your website:
"We practice extended breastfeeding, bed sharing, unschooling, no vaccines, and
more! We raise our children pro-choice and religion free."

What does "extended breastfeeding" entail...like until they turn 10? And what exactly is "unschooling"? Never heard of that one.
"No vaccines"...are you for real? It is because of people ignorant like you who are bringing back polio, whooping cough, and Measles into our society.


Kerri
Tuesday, December 30, 2003 at 16:23:19 (EST)
After reading and even re-reading some of these posts, I can't BELIEVE some of the justifications for abortions. As a licensed ultrasound technician I MUST OBJECT!! "Saraj" feels comfortable aborting in the early stages when the preg. is barely detectable on the ultrasound OMG OMG! At four-five weeks, when women generally learn they are